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Wednesday, November 17, 2010

God is not the author of sin

I'm saving this on my blog just in case the Theo section on HCR gets erased again.

Originally Posted by PoLemiCs View Post
justin my man.....I've been responding from my phone which really sucks lol....but ima get to a computer later and help you out on this because you most def confused......but ima holla.....unless you rather call me later....
Does god want you to sin? Yes or no

According to Seal it's yes! There is no way for Seal to really get out of it! He can't have it both ways.......eventhough both you and him are trying to have it both ways.

If you are going to advocate "monergism" in Sanctification then you will automatically run into trouble when it comes to the issue of sin.

Does god want you to sin? Yes or no

If god doesn't want you to sin then why doesn't he stop you? If you believe god's willing in you to both will and believe to be monergistic, then why didn't he stop you from sinning? If he is willing you monergistically then he obviously wants you to sin .....wants you to fall! You can't have it both ways!

If god ordained you to sin at 5pm today then that means he wants you to sin!

So why not give god the glory for your sin?

There is no way to get out of it. You make god both good and evil! This is dualism! And this isn't the GOD of Scripture!

You all make god the author of sin. God is not the author of sin!

Originally Posted by JARZJR View Post
Did God want the Romans and the Jews to conspire to commit the greatest sin in history against the Christ?

In one sense yes, and in another sense, no...

Same with all sins...
Both Matt 23:37, Romans 1, and 1st Corinthians 10 talk about synergy, not monergy.

This is what God wanted! But because they were not willing, God turned them over to their evil desires, and they eventually killed their Creator(God Incarnate) on a Cross!
Matthew 23: 37
"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing.

God turns people over to their evil desires......this can only happen in synergy!
Romans 1
"For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts."

This is what God wants! However, according to you all.......god is not faithful for he really wants you to fall.
1 Corinthians 10:13
“There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.”

God doesn't want you to sin homey! But He will turn you over to your evil desires if you remain unwilling. This can only happen in Synergy.

According to you all, god doesn't make a way of escape because he wants you to sin. In monergy, if god doesn't move you to say no to your evil desires, then guess what? You have no choice but to fall to your evil desires!

There is no way getting around it! You may not want to believe it, but everything in your system says "god is the author of sin"

Such a thing is first rank HERESY!

Originally Posted by PoLemiCs View Post
jnorm, that was a whole lot of assumptions homie......strawman arguments dont work around here bro, you should know though.....I will get to you as well young man....I dont expect you to fully grasp this stuff right now so forgive me if I dont unleash on your posts with urgency lol....but it does seem that you cats are either not reading my posts carefully and only skimming or not understanding what is said or i just suck at communication...haha...but i'll get to you bro cuz its pretty much the same assertions......right now though I would like to focus my attention to my man justin and help the brotha along in his theology, a systematic one to be also are confused on what secondary causes is and means.....
It's the implications of what you say. You want to have it both ways, and I'm trying to show both you and Seal that you can't. You can't have it both ways.

I already know who in the Reformed protestant world teach such damnable heresy:

1.) Gordan Clark
2.) Jay Adams
3.) R.C. Sproul Jr
4.) Vincent Cheung

Others in the Reformed protestant world need to condemn it as heresy as well. They(the 4 mentioned above) all make god the author of sin. This is pure heresy and it is not the view passed on to the Saints.

The Early Christians fought hard against such blasphemy. I stick to their interpretation of Scripture.

"I have proved in what has been said that those who were foreknown to be unrighteous, whether men or angels, are not made wicked by God's fault. Rather, each man is what he will appear to be through his own fault." Justin Martyr 160 A.D.

"We were not created to die. Rather, we die by our own fault. Our free will has destroyed us. We who were free have become slaves. We have been sold through sin. Nothing evil has been created by God. We ourselves have manifested wickedness. But we, who have manifested it, are able again to reject it" Tatian 160 A.D.

"God did not make evil. Nor is He at all in any way the Author of evil. But whoever failed to keep the Law.....after being created by God with the faculty of free called evil." Methodius 290 A.D.

The view advocated by the Reformed protestants above was not the view advocated by Jesus, the Apostles, and the church fathers, and early witnesses after them.

It is not a christian view.

If you take a look at the 5th and 6th councils, as well as the work of Saint Maximus the confessor, then you will understand why 2nd causes won't help the argument......especially if you believe in "determinism".

And this is why you can't have it both ways. And this is why I was talking about "implications". The onlything you can do is not think about it and call it a mystery, but that in and of itself won't get rid of the infrastructure of your system, which can only lead in one direction, and that direction is god being the author of sin.

Wisdom 1:13-15 & 2:23-24
""13 because God did not make death,
and he does not delight in the death of the living.
14 For he created all things so that they might exist;
the generative forces* of the world are wholesome,
and there is no destructive poison in them,
and the dominion* of Hades is not on earth.
15 For righteousness is immortal.

23 for God created us for incorruption,
and made us in the image of his own eternity,*
24 but through the devil’s envy death entered the world,
and those who belong to his company experience it."

James 1:12-18
"Blessed is the man who endures temptation; for when he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does He Himself tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and comes down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shadow of turning. Of His own will He brought us forth by the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of His creatures."

The evil desire didn't come from God. God permitted/allowed the fall, but you all don't believe in God allowing stuff to all don't believe in God permitting stuff to happen. Seal, KingNeb and maybe others want god to have an "active" role.

And when it comes to personal sin, some on the board want god to have an active role in personal sin.......not a passive(allowing/permitting) role.


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